World Tafl Federation

unhandyandy
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by unhandyandy » Thu Jan 10, 2019 5:23 am

;) Right, my idea was to have a Master title instead of GM or IM.

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Hagbard
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by Hagbard » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:43 am

Casshern wrote:
Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:24 am
I think of these titles as trophies or medals that can be passed out to different players. The question I have is, should these titles only be given to the most recent winner (meaning they get passed/transferred) or each winner forever keeps their title(s) (meaning there could be multiples of each and players could have multiple titles)?
The idea is to pass on the HH, SEA, BERS and QUAD to the new winners.

Actually, there has come a special interest in the 9x9 version of Historical Hnefatafl, the Saami Tablut 9x9, in the Norwegian Sápmi (Mikkel Berg-Nordlie, "Mihkkal") and in the Moscow Geek Wars club (Alexander V. Fomichev, "Ded Fomich").

Tablut 9x9 together with the Welsh Tawlbwrdd 11x11 are the two most well-founded historical tafl games, and therefore it would be interesting to split the HH into a HH Tablut Master and a HH Tawlbwrdd Master.

In five days the HH Master tournament will start, which is this time Tawlbwrdd. I suggest that the tournament series continues with a HH Tablut Master tournament Feb. 15th! (finding the master, but outside of the quadrathlon calculation of this year.)

- And while we're at it, a Fetlar Master tournament March 1st? To find the most skilled player for strong king without the Copenhagen extras.

Ded Fomich
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by Ded Fomich » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:04 pm

If we are to fully accept the conception of the grandmaster’s title which is very difficult to get and the format of tournaments with at least 4 grandmasters or at least 8 players rated 1800 and higher, then, in my view, we need a bigger community, more active high-rated players and a regulation on obligatory participation of grandmasters in tournaments or something like that (for example, loss of the title or drop in rankings for non-participation).

According to the Aage’s information about busiest players of the last year we have only one active grandmaster, it’s Casshern. In the last championship tournament we could see only one of the total number of grandmasters, it was Adam. I also can’t recall non-championship tournaments with at least 8 high-rated players. It all means that at the moment the title is unreachable for the challengers, the only way is to take the first place in the Valhǫll group and play only Copenhagen tafl.

The situation is exacerbated by all that mentioned by Casshern reasons regarding rankings and by existing of several tafl variants. For example, I never play variants with corner exits because of many personal reasons, I only teach people here in Moscow to play it, because it’s the most popular variant of tafl and many people like it. I’m a big fan of the historical hnefatafl rules and mostly play games using them, the historical background of Tablut led me to discovering many things about the Viking Age, Old Norse, history in general, etc. I’m not a sportsman, I play historical tafl because of my obsession with its background, not because of titles or rankings. But if any ambitious sportsman was in my position, then he couldn’t count on getting the title of grandmaster with the application of this new conception, at the moment we just have not enough players and regulations for its realisation. Moreover, at the moment it separates a “true” sportsman using Copenhagen rules from a “non-true” sportsman who prefers other variants. Presently the first one can be a grandmaster, the second one can not. Nowadays it seems harmful for development of other tafl variants if we look at tafl in the context of sport.

So I think that in the present situation it wouldn’t do any harm if we have here some separate titles for other variants of tafl, they could motivate people with sporting sense and ambitions. These titles could also inspire people to try other tafl variants (the undeservedly left out in the cold Sea Battle Tafl, for example). The new conception could start working only if we have a quite big community with active and motivated high-rated players.
Last edited by Ded Fomich on Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ded Fomich
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by Ded Fomich » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:22 pm

Hagbard wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:43 am
Actually, there has come a special interest in the 9x9 version of Historical Hnefatafl, the Saami Tablut 9x9, in the Norwegian Sápmi (Mikkel Berg-Nordlie, "Mihkkal") and in the Moscow Geek Wars club (Alexander V. Fomichev, "Ded Fomich").
Hell yes! In my case, it’s an interest which borders on the obsession. There are no other rules but the Historical Hnefatafl rules and Saami Tablut is their Prophet! ;)

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Hagbard
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by Hagbard » Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:55 pm

Elaborating on the Federation Master (FM).

I propose that a player can become a Federation Master (FM) if
- he is rated at least 1600
- he has played at least 500 games
- he has qualified in at least three tournaments within a rolling period of three years, this way
--- at least 80% point win in tournaments with one round (normal variants with at least 6 players, of which at least two more are rated at least 1800),
--- or at least 60% point win in the final round of tournaments with more rounds (no opponents rated below 1500). Again at least two more must be rated at least 1800.
Update May 28th:
Counting through all tournaments since 2011, finding number of tourn. qualifying for FM:
Casshern 5 (GM) (rating 2100, 868 games) *
Crust 3 (GM) (rating 1848, 3037 games) *
Adam 3 (GM) (rating 1809, 689 games) *
2 tournaments: Plantagenet (GM), Odinhimself (IM), Nath (GM), Altti (IM)
1 tournament: Schachus (GM), Herjan (GM), Ded fomich, Khan asparukh, Hagbard, Sqaree
Ded Fomich wrote: Moreover, at the moment it separates a “true” sportsman using Copenhagen rules from a “non-true” sportsman who prefers other variants. Presently the first one can be a grandmaster, the second one can not.
This method of calculation for FM makes all variants equal. You could qualify playing Saami Tablut only, or in any mix of variants.

It will be very hard to fulfil the reqirements for FM, but probably slightly easier than winning a World Championship and the GM.
Last edited by Hagbard on Wed May 29, 2019 8:02 am, edited 38 times in total.

nath
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by nath » Tue Jan 15, 2019 12:34 am

I'm not entirely sure whether I should want more titles right now. What I am sure about however is that it's a bad idea to couple stuff with the fairly ambiguous rating.

I think we should try to make a title mean something special, to show that a player archived something notable.

I don#t even think we should put every of your titles into a ranking. Being strong in Copenhagen Hnefatafl and strong in bunch of variants can be both special on it's own, but I am opposed to mix them together. I don't mind giving a title for any particular variant, but it's best to let them be different for different variants.

I am furthermore not convinced we need more titles at all. Odin is already IM, and I think that means something. I'd love to bring some action, but I think titles that are just awarded without work, don't benefit the community.

I'd love to be part of an real life tournament. Are there any other people interested? I could try to get a location Berlin if there is a general interest (and not just four people).

All the best
nath

sqAree
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by sqAree » Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:20 am

I would be very interested to join a real life tournament if the date fits and if it's Copenhagen Tafl!

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Hagbard
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by Hagbard » Wed Jan 16, 2019 10:49 am

Elaborating on the Candidate Master (CM).

A Federation Master from the FM scheme above is as seldom as snow in June.

I took another look at the CM idea and

I propose that a player can become a Candidate Master (CM) if
- he is rated at least 1500
- he has played at least 500 games
- he has qualified in at least three tournaments within a rolling period of three years, this way
--- at least 60% point win in tournaments with one round (normal variants with at least 6 players, of which at least two more are rated at least 1600)
--- or at least 20% point win in the final round of tournaments with more rounds (no opponents rated below 1500). Again at least two more must be rated at least 1600.
Update May 28th:
Counting through all tournaments since 2011, finding number of tourn. qualifying for CM:
Crust 16 (GM)
Altti 14 (IM)
Casshern 12 (GM)
Adam 10 (GM)
Duhawk93 10 (rating 1569, 897 games) *
Hagbard 10 (rating 1650, 2719 games) *
Animals 9 (rating 1676, 462 games)
Xerxes 7 (rating 1429, 1077 games) *
Docbullen 6 (rating 1514, 1136 games) *
Ded fomich 5 (rating 1864, 455 games)
Khan asparukh 5 (rating 1840, 174 games)
Epoc 5 (rating 1467, 417 games)
Sqaree 5 (rating 1702, 294 games)
Nath 4 (GM)
Arne64 4 (rating 1697, 495 games)
Odinhimself 4 (IM)
Agmundr 3 (rating 1573, 1021 games) *
Sigurd 3
2 tournaments: Plantagenet (GM), Edmond-dantes, Chuck ward, Bigwurm91
1 tournament: Kllimm, Steiger, Schachus, Herjan, Bogd Khan, Hnefihunter, Unhandyandy, Kratzer, Luigi005, Cyningstan, Tuireann, Anto2016, Jrton80
Last edited by Hagbard on Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:36 am, edited 43 times in total.

nath
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by nath » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:58 pm

Can you elaborate why you want a CM title at all?

Regards
nath

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Hagbard
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Re: World Tafl Federation

Post by Hagbard » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:17 am

It is the only label within reach of strong players, without having to be in the top five elite.

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